A Jesus that melts in your mouth!
Now that sure beats those lousy dry wafers. One thing I can't stand is a crunchy Jesus. Unless he's served with cold cuts of course.
Tyrone van leyen
JoinedPosts by Tyrone van leyen
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11
Oh Sweet Lord!
by cameo-d in"it is terrible that jesus is being wrapped up in gold foil and sold along with chocolate bunnies, edible penguins and lollipops," said aegidius engel, a spokesman for the archbishopric of nearby paderborn.. .
frank oynhausen set up his "sweet lord" chocolate jesus-making business saying he wanted to restore some traditional religious values to christmas in germany.. .
oynhausen is now custom-producing the chocolate jesus figures, at a cost of 15 euros for 100 grams, but by easter he hopes to have a partnership with a mass producer.. "we're hoping to be able to export them around the world one day," oynhausen said.
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21
Freewill or Ultimatum?
by cameo-d inwhat is the difference?.
was adam given freewill or ultimatum?.
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Tyrone van leyen
Exactly Cameo, if there were no strings attached and someone truly chose to serve God becuase they love him rather than because there is a threat this has more a ring of genuine love.
If God made us knowing our desires and fears, then what satisfaction would there be in getting someone to love you through coercsion?
If you gave the gift of a bike to kid, knowing they want it, because they love to explore and told them they could only drive it in the parking lot, you are actually creating a temptation and form of torment.
If he loves me, he won't drive the bike on the road. This is sick thinking. If he loves you he will drive the bike on the road so he can fully appreciate the gift you gave him.
Then you can really show your deep love by grounding him, and it becomes a worse gift because your not letting him use his natural inclination to explore and learn the rules of the road and in the end you've taken more away than you've given. This is not love.
If you love something, let it go. If it comes back to you, it was truly yours to begin with, if it doesn't it never was.
In prison if you give something to someone, and they put it in their cell, they can own you. You can become their bitch. True love. This is very sick thinking! Jail mentality from the holy of holies.
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11
Why aren't JW's exposed in the news on 60 Minutes?
by BonaFide ini know we had the dateline show a few years ago, but what about recently?.
seems to me that with about a million members in the us, and all the strange policies like blood transfusions, informing authorities re child molestation, disfellowshipping, that it would be a big story.
especially with so many witnesses that are depressed, or suicidal, or with the broken marriages, or children that die or those that are shunned.
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Tyrone van leyen
Interesting Seeker. I'll take your word for it. That's why I said it's my take. I don't know anything bout journalism and you obviously have a more informed stance in that area. That's a scary thought. What the hell is it gonna take to get attention on the matter? I can't beleive Paris Hilton gets more atention. Strange world.
Now that I think about it, they didn't give a hoot about David Koresh, Marshall Applegate, or Jim Jones till it was too late and those guys were a damn circus.
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49
DF and shunning to end soon...jw numbers will triple
by oompa inrecently at the beach house with my df studly son...a carload of young jw's in service drove by and saw us...old friends of his/me...they turned around and stopped...hugs and all!...i loved them treating him so human.
most dubs now hate to shun...esp.
their own family and there is less and less of it...my own mom will not shun my son, but dad will...she just told me she has no prob treating my son as just her normal grandson because she believe no kids should be allowed to be baptised!....i love you mom!
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Tyrone van leyen
In my opinion there would be outrage and perhaps even people leaving on account of such a prospect. Think of the hundreds of thousands of messed up familes that gave blind obedience to shunning their own and ruined there families. This kind of flip flop like the blood issue are not joking matters. If people stayed in after that kind of new light they have to be completely brain dead.
These are areas that test loyalty in the cult. If you weaken their strongest tool they will become more mainstream. Less control. This is a cult remember. People would ask what the hell were we listening to these fools for? Credibility would plummet. But, then again, never underestimate the stupidity and weakmindedness of a follower. I even know of some fools who sold their houses in 75 and struggled therafter and still were loyal.
The Catholic church with an epidemic of pedophile preists lost many followers, but their are still some hardcore losers, that wouldn't see the light if the Pope became a Necropheliac and wore a Jock strap to mass! Hell he was even kissing the Koran not too long ago. But still I don't think Catholosism is a cult.
Consider too, if you didn't get shunned for being naughty, then why stay there? You can be naughty elsewhere without the rules and God will still loves their asses.
Without the power of shunning, you could tell them to piss up a rope, if you didn't feel like distributing their toilet paper called the watchtower. Not good for business.
If a witness sees that they are not superior to anyone by shunning them, this will mean they arn't so damn special after all. If they arn't so special, why pay any attention to someone who wants to take your holidays away, mess up your school life, rob you of every ounce of joy there is, and bore you to death, 4 days a week.
I have never known a cult to soften their framework of control. Usually it increases and gets crazier. This is what defines them.
The only way you may be right, is in attracting new ones who arn't in the know. This is what happened in 75. Mass numbers left in disgust, but more ignorant ones eventually filled the gaps and they actually got increase after it blew over and was forgotten like Beth Sarim.
If they thought canning Rutherfords shunning business would help matters, they would have done it long ago. It can't even be defended by scripture.
It's like saying to a bunch of guys in prison. Hey look we've made some changes. You still have to live by the rules in here, but wev'e decided to be kinder now, so we took the locks off your cells. By the way, sorry for the inconvenience of messing your life up. We really hope you'll stay with us and reform yourselves.
Beleive it or not, in this scenario some who have become so used to prison life would indeed stay, because they know nothing else, and actually fear normal societal living. The majority would leave though.
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11
Why aren't JW's exposed in the news on 60 Minutes?
by BonaFide ini know we had the dateline show a few years ago, but what about recently?.
seems to me that with about a million members in the us, and all the strange policies like blood transfusions, informing authorities re child molestation, disfellowshipping, that it would be a big story.
especially with so many witnesses that are depressed, or suicidal, or with the broken marriages, or children that die or those that are shunned.
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Tyrone van leyen
I think Cameo is on the money. Just like the gag order placed on the 16 who got 60 million for sexual abuse in California. Legally the org. has been defending themselves for the last 130 years and I think they know who to pay off and who to shut the hell up.
It shouldn't suprize anyone these days that the media says whatever the hell they're told to, or told not to. They are just puppets. The internet is about the only place you can get the unfettered details where nobodies getting paid. That's my take anyhow.
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Tyrone van leyen
I didn't realize it was some kind of privilige. I didn't ask to be born, nor was I given a choice on the matter. For some it's pure hell.
There are many things people don't deserve, like a kid being born deformed or severly handicapped. We all get a different hand and have no choice but to play it out.
From a societal point of veiw, we all add to the value of the human race even those with handicaps. People that don't deserve to live, are those who intentially seek to harm others ( for no reason) and are evil. Even then society will not kill them.
I deserve to live because I made a conscious choice to be good without religion and without a God. WE can't go through life and not harm anyone. That's just impossible. Many things can happen in survival mode as well. Look at the cruelty of nature. What animals deserve to live? Those that we have chosen to be companions, those that are not harmful to us but we eat on our dinner tables once they are fattened up.
Animals arn't evil, they are instinctual. Humans make choices and cause far more damage than any other animal on the planet. Do we coexist with mother earth? Perhaps very few, if any, of us deserve to live.
When I speak of good and evil a part of me says there is a God watching and he is the one that decides this. At the same time I could also say that we are living in a world he made with very little power, very little knowledge and very little time. If someone is desparate they will do something desparate things.
I could also say that we don't have any choice in anything. We could look at ourselves literally as complex biochemical mathematical equations unfolding in a universe that continues to create life good and bad. That means that if I reach out to get a coffee cup, I really didn't have any choice in the matter even if I thought it was really me doing it. The action of me reaching for the cup, is a chemical reaction going on in a biochemical machine that processes the data and causes my arm to flex certain muscles to reach for the cup. Not only that, who I am and all that is required for me to reach that cup includes all my ancestors who survived to pass their lineage on to me. All the actions they took are the biochemical responses that were needed to ensure I would be here to grab that cup. This too forms part of the massive equations that are continuously unfolding. It is all mathematically predetermined and we have no more choice over the matter than a car that is driving. That car was mathematically engineered to do exactly what it does.
If we are able to develop artificial intelligence and eventually life itself, whatever was made, didn't have the choice, and do we have the right to kill it if we so desire?
If we look upon all things as machines, then perhaps evil is something that can be re engineered.
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WT: Dumbing down the message; no intellectuals allowed
by Hiddenwindow inhave you noticed that the most recent publications by the watch tower, and particularly the study articles of the watchtower magazine, contain less and less references to secular sources?
there is not doubt that the society was always making efforts to provide us with a historical and quasi-intellectual perspective of the world.
i am sure all of you can think of books by the watch tower that contained extensive information on history, biology, and even philosophy (insight, creation book, the bible -god's word or man's?
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Tyrone van leyen
How strange to be dumbing down a message after 130 years. The beginnings of the volumes studies in the scriptures, written by Russell, was touted as an absolute necessity to have any understanding of the scriptures. Now all that convoluted tripe, has no value whatsoever, and can hardly be recognized as being from the same religion.
Isn't it interesting, that with all that bright light shining, in all it's complexities for so many years, that we need to lose 50 IQ points for the light to shine ever more clearly today.
I think Russels efforts were probably the best at explaining things in a scholarly effort, but it was still garbage. When Rutherford came on the scene, he opened up the area of double talk from being a lawyer, and his Rainbow of bullshit style, lasted for a long time.
In days of mass entertainment, internet and large amounts of distraction, no one wants to read and hash over things, that will bore them to tears. This is a publishing company, and if the public wants Archie comics instead of pseudo scholarly lingo, written by a team of evasive word arrangers, give it to them. There's no harm here. The simple and the complex both equate to the same thing. Literary garbage!
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Tyrone van leyen
"Neither will mourning, nor outcry, nor pain, be anymore the former things have passed away. I can't remember the whole thing, but moslty those are states of mind. Even a boy leading a lion is a state of mind in the animal. A lion does imply, however an earthly situation.
We can only see paradise as earthly because we are not omnipotent entities living in the 11th dimension. Perhaps there will be no more tears or pain, because we won't exist in bodies, but only our essence. Just as Christ seemed to have mastery over his physical enviornment.
"The world is passing away and so is it's desires."
The world passing away, implies another form of existence, and desires passing away, seems another form of altered consciousness.
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13
Sin: A Desire for Knowledge?
by cameo-d ineve desired wisdom and knowledge.
the apple was symbolic of wisdom and knowledge.
although it is sometimes said that the sin was "disobedience", why would the creator not wish for his creation to grow and mature?
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Tyrone van leyen
Ha. it reminds of that song Empty Garden by Elton John.
First, I detect a spirit of meaness. It like an all knowing, all loving deity has just got to get back at these two peices of clay he shaped into humans. Killing them is not enough. He has to make their life difficult first and then make sure they have kids so the fun can continue.
Imagine two angels with swords needed to protect an empty garden with two semi naked humans on the entire planet. That's better security than most banks have. Was it to protect them from eating from the tree of life? Well I got a better idea, why don't you just remove the tree and let them live in peace until they die since it was you, that let them get fooled them in the fisrt place.
Imagine if you have a kid and they are made by you in a sense. It is utter cruelty.
I have also thought as you, that this is a cock and bull story, about them being the family of the human race. How in the hell would anyone know. I have always felt that there was always a possibiblty that there were other humans on the earth and the story of Adam and eve is just where they decided it to begin. God could play games like that if he wished. Perhaps God let evolution continue from cromagnon down to this pair, which is when he decided to play his games with these particular illiterates.
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Tyrone van leyen
I remember a scripture, that perhaps someone can actually find, that when asked about the kingdom of God, Jesus says It is neither here nor there, but it is in your midst. To me this means that this kingdom is a frame of mind.
It is the way you perceive the world and how you interact with others. In theory, if all the baloney about love and caring were true, the earth would be paradise.
I think paradised to Jesus was more a way of looking at things and matters of the heart. The rest is just physical.
The point is actually a good one. You can live in a beautiful scenic comfortable home but if your'e surrounded by evil you might as well be living in hell. I've experienced it myself. Paradise is a frame of mind.
If you take mind altering drugs such as ectasy, MDA, or opium, this state of mind illustrates an illusary form of paradise while still living in a shithole.